A surprising lack of discourse

August 17 2004

Last week, I blogged the announcement of end of support for Notes/Domino R5.  Of the eight comments, most seemed to be wistful about R5, the release that was, rather than anything about the announcement itself.
I have to admit that I was expecting more comment on this.  IBM's tracking studies and support calls show that the majority of customers are now running Notes/Domino 6.x releases, Most of you report to me that you (or your customers) are already there or well on their way to upgrading.
On the other hand, the Notes/Domino 7 beta forum traffic is still pretty light, even after the release of beta 2.  I know there are sought-after features in the beta release, though thankfully "ND7" hasn't become the default answer to life, the universe, and everything.  I suppose since the ship date is next calendar year, most of you are focused on 2004 projects at the moment, which makes sense.
Getting to my point -- the Lotusphere 2005 content machine is starting to rev up (yes, already!).  I'm trying to use the relative information about R5, ND6.x, ND7 beta to help weight out the kind of content we'll see in Orlando in January.  The discourse about 5/6/7 is a good indication of where to set content priorities...right?

Ed Brill | Highland Park, IL USA Category:  Lotusphere 05  Add/View Comments [20]

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  1. 1  Tony Lee  | 8/17/2004 9:21:44 AM

    ... I'm seeing really smart Notes people (and then there's me) still discovering features in ND6. Gotta have that all figured out before ND7.

  1. 2    | 8/17/2004 9:43:09 AM

  1. 3  Mike Brown  | 8/17/2004 9:47:30 AM

    If people we're unhappy about the retirement date, you can be sure that they would have told you, Ed! The lack of response is for exactly the reasons that you gave; most of us are either on 6 or in the process of moving. And anybody who's not in either of those two groups, well they've still got over a year to get their asses in gear.

    As for 7, I downloaded it for the first time ever, only last weekend. (I think you know the reason why I hadn't bothered before that!)

    Cheers,

    - Mike

  1. 4  Tim Latta  | 8/17/2004 9:52:24 AM

    Yes, include 5/6/7 content at L-sphere 05, but more importantly, include Notes/Domino/Sametime/QuickPlace/Dom.Doc/etc. content at L-sphere 05. Sure, there's room for Workplace content, but don't neglect the (current) masses.

  1. 5  Declan Lynch  | 8/17/2004 10:27:04 AM

    If there was a direct link to the ND7 beta forum from the notes.net homepage then a lot more people would see it and use it. As it is if you want to access the forum you have 3 clicks from the homepage to get to it.

  1. 6  tom o’neil http://www.realoneil.com/rusty | 8/17/2004 10:58:16 AM

    I bet people were too busy with their .NET projects to notice the R5 retirement schedule. ;o)

  1. 7  Duffbert http://www.twduff.com | 8/17/2004 11:11:50 AM

    I'd have to think that your assumption on weighting is correct, Ed. I've always been a little frustrated at LS when there is a ton of content on the "new" or bleeding edge stuff and little focus paid on where most of the attendees live and die. For instance, I purposely ignored Raven the year it was the hot topic. It made the scheduling much easier... :-)

    I'd put most of the emphasis on ND6 when it comes to Notes-specific sessions, followed by ND7. Honestly I wouldn't pay too much attention to R5 specific content at all.

  1. 8  SpzToid  | 8/17/2004 1:02:56 PM

    It seems every major release of Domino allows for the consolidation of servers, and this was true in the transistion from R5 -> R6.

    From my experience the reason is two-fold: R6 performs significantly better than R5, ('cuz of multi-tasking or whatever; I dunno, but I can see it), plus obvious hardware improvements means admins of very large sites can do more with less, as time goes on.

    My $.02 says folks using R5 are conservatively happy, and have little need for change, and your resources are best left promoting R6 & R7 Ed.

    P.S. R4, R5, etc., it's all good! That's why (whoever) still has up it running like a clock.

  1. 9  Wild Bill http://www.billbuchan.com | 8/17/2004 1:22:26 PM

    Lots of us poor future peddlars need the "next version" information to try and drive out Domino v7 projects. I think spendig the vast majority of Domino time on new features would drive out the ND7 message more..

    And anyways - ND6 has been out for *ages*. The only think we need to know about it is where the client "easter egg" is!

    ---* Bill

  1. 10  Stan Rogers  | 8/17/2004 2:35:09 PM

    When the publick beta for RNext was released, there were a whole pile of bells and whistles and @Stuff and classes and things to get (sometimes overly) excited about. The ND7 beta just starts to touch on things new and exciting in Beta 2 -- all you really got out of Beta 1 was the rush of installing DB2 successfully. Yeah, there was a new storage bin, but there wasn't anything you could really do with it that you couldn't already do with ND6. In Beta 2 you get access and query views along with the whole web services deal. Those are the sort of things it takes to get a buzz going -- and it's my humble opinion that they should have been in place when the public beta started. As it stands, we (not just IBM Lotus, but the community) have to try to bring back the people who came, and saw, and said "so what?"

  1. 11  Angel Figueroa  | 8/17/2004 3:06:51 PM

    I think the focus should be on ND7 amd the accompaning products, like sametime, domino.doc, etc. There should be some sessions on ND6 and even some covering ND8, though the latter should be limited.

    I have been disappointed in the past at Lotusphere, having to sit through sessions covering features or functionality that have been in the product for a year or more. Granted, sometimes you pick up some golden nuggets of information but please, please cover the new version in greater detail.

    BTW: Th hands-on-labs were the best last year. I hope that you expand on them this year.

  1. 12  Paul Mooney http://www.pmooney.net | 8/17/2004 3:25:49 PM

    Many people are in process of ND6.5 upgrade at present, and so many people are still just "getting" the IM integration. This is such a major change (especially with the ease of application / IM integration) that this is where companies / consultants are at present. ND7 just seems a bit too far on the horizon at present. Don't get me wrong... keep the pace of solid upgrades coming! Lotusphere should cover 7 / 8 and the collaberation products.

  1. 13  Ken Porter  | 8/17/2004 6:18:32 PM

    Personally, I have been reading the ND7 beta forum, but I have yet to download the client. I simply haven't had the time to do it.

    I earn a living working in ND 6, so I have to make sure that version works. As much as I love the new installers Notes now uses ( and I am a fan of them! ), it isn't as simple as it once was to simply download a beta, install it, and take it for a spin. I know it is possible, but I also realize I must take steps to protect my ND6 working environment. I plan on figuring it out in September after my vacation is over.

    Ken

  1. 14  Adam Osborne  | 8/18/2004 6:24:13 AM

    Unfortunately, there is very little in R7 (at the moment) that my customers currently need and R5 has been a stable workhorse for ages.

    R6 is their current focus and many of my customers are still yet to fully exploit it.

    What we really need are fixes for the (what feels likes 100s) of sprs tagged 'Not to be fixed in this release' The ones that can be fixed now, if resources were assigned to them. Also how about some for the easy to do feature requests. How about printing that works... the little things lol.

    Anyway, I'm looking forward to R7 but sadly can't see any of our customers move to it in the first 12-18 months.

  1. 15  Jeremy Teran  | 8/18/2004 12:51:32 PM

    If I go to L-sphere '05 I would like to see more about ND7, maybe a peek at ND8, or 2. But most of all I would like to hear more about Domino and Sametime and less about Websphere / Workplace. I talked to several people at the '04 conference and heard the same thing from them. Most people go to the conference for the Domino stuff, give them enough about the other products to educate them about their options, but don't beat them silly on something they don't have on their radar yet. As for the R5 people, they've had enought time and L-sphere's to learn all about that release - it's time to move on to the newer stuff and not become too stale in what is being presented.

  1. 16  Scott Stewart  | 8/18/2004 1:11:06 PM

    Ed,

    I agree that I don't need more than a "what's new in.." session for ND7+. Labs are great too. I would recommend potentially expanding the hours of availability to include at least one evening (Tuesday?).

    Personal preference for LS 2005 content would be something like the following:

    1) Client upgrade best practices/challenges/lessons learned

    2) Advanced features of ND6.5.x

    3) ND Roadmap, including plans for 7/8

    4) Building real-world business applications with Domino

    5) Continue to stress investment in ND is safe (low-key on Websphere and Workplace ... but I know this won't happen)

    6) Technical and business advantages of Lotus software compared to M$ Sharepoint, LCS, Live Meeting etc. technologies.

    7) Building a business case for upgrades, enhancements to Domino infrastructure.

    8) Best practices in server-based e-mail archiving, retention, compliance, etc.

    9) Best practices in securing Domino e-mail infrastructure from SPAM,phishing,javascript viruses, etc.

    ... and of course...

    10) The latest "The boss loves M$..." (big fan of Celebrity Deathmatch ;-) )

    I know most of these are annual LS staples, but I would like to see more in-depth focus of these items. Those sessions by Lotus Business Partners have been some of the more technical and informative, taking nothing away from the IBM presenters of course.

    As a general rule, more N&D, less WP & WS.

    Just my $0.02 worth.

  1. 17  Alan Bell http://www.dominux.co.uk | 8/19/2004 5:36:45 AM

    I go to conferences to learn about new stuff, If I knew about it before I started then I would not learn so much. I haven't got round to playing with R7 yet, but my main customer is on 6.5.1. Maybe I will push them to R7 when I learn more about what I can build on the new platform.

  1. 18  Tim Knutsen  | 8/25/2004 10:02:19 AM

    Since Lotus/IBM advised that they plan to roll out major upgrades (i.e. ND6.5, ND7, ND8) now in a twelve month vrs. the past 18 month cycle, my organization (soon to be separated from the Dana organization) will most likely skip ever other release. The reasoning is simple, we simply do not have the time or resources to devote to migrating 2500 users to a new version every year. With the compatibility testing, server/client upgrades and all the associated issues involved in a major migration to a new version, it is not worth the money every year. And yes I understand the reasoning for Lotus/IBM for this strategy, money. Shorten the release time and improve revenues. But I think they will see more organizations like mine take this route. There simply is not sufficient reason to run a continuous upgrade team in any organization for the benefits of new features in every release.

    Just a few thoughts,

    Tim

  1. 19  Brian Sniegocki  | 8/26/2005 2:24:46 PM

    Ed, I didn't know there was a ND7 beta forum until last week, and then it is a general forum, you have to sort through unrelated post to find information. The search also requires you to login, whats up with that?.

  1. 20  Ben Poole http://www.benpoole.com | 8/26/2005 3:52:10 PM

    We're about to move to 6 I believe. I haven't yet coded an ND6.x-only app in Domino at work (although my site has been running on 6 since the early betas), and I imagine that this usage pattern is prevalent in large orgs like mine. 7 isn't even on the radar.