ITWeb South Africa: MS comes out swinging

August 12 2009

This speaks for itself on so many levels.

As for IBM, [Microsoft managing director Mteto Nyati] said: "We need to make sure the customers of IBM are liberated from Lotus Notes. Just by moving across they will feel so liberated, and start enjoying things like unified communications. I would like to make SA a Lotus Notes-free country."
Have to get in line behind North Korea for that.

Link: ITWeb South Africa: MS comes out swinging >

Ed Brill | Highland Park, IL USA Category:  Microsoft  Add/View Comments [32]

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  1. 1  Keith Brooks http://www.vanessabrooks.com | 8/12/2009 10:34:33 PM

    Interesting choice of words, especially in SA.

  1. 2  Nathan T. Freeman http://nathan.lotus911.com | 8/12/2009 10:47:37 PM

    I'm confused by the comparison here, Ed. While I'll be the first to point out that SA has some major social and political problems, the US embargo against South Africa ended some 13 years ago. They've had free elections since 1995. How does that compare to North Korea?

    I mean, the head of MSFT SA wants to make South Africa a Notes-free country? Hell, I'd like to make the US a Microsoft-free country. Is it somehow wrong to want to be successful against your competitor? That's what free markets are all about, aren't they?

  1. 3  tonyo  | 8/12/2009 11:05:24 PM

    I think liberate is a great verb to use - since IBM endorsed using it first :)

  1. 4  Anthony Holmes http://www.workingcollaboration.com | 8/12/2009 11:35:28 PM

    @2 Nathan: here's (roughly) the point I think that Ed is making.

    It's not in any way a criticism of South Africa.

    Microsoft sometimes allege that there are countries in the world without Notes/Domino.

    But they never provide evidence of this.

    Now Mteto Nyati has the wildly improbable notion that South Africa might become a Notes/Domino free country.

    To which Ed responds that there is only one country in the world that can reliably be called Notes free: namely North Korea, (and that's specifically because Notes/Domino isn't allowed to be exported there.) So it's North Korea that Mtoto Nyati is aiming to emulate. Not such a noble aspiration.

    In my opinion, the "countries free of Notes/Domino" story is a meme that Microsoft are trying to build up by getting different people to simply say it from time to time. Unfortunately if you say something often enough, sometimes some people start to think it's true.

  1. 5  Nathan T. Freeman http://nathan.lotus911.comT | 8/13/2009 12:07:07 AM

    @3 - And who wouldn't endorse using "liberate?" It's a word rooted in "liberty." And what does liberty mean?

    "freedom from control, interference, obligation, restriction, hampering conditions, etc.; power or right of doing, thinking, speaking, etc., according to choice."

    So freedom from control, obligation and restriction should be HUGELY important to South Africans. I wonder, between Lotus and Microsoft, who offers fewer controls, obligations, restrictions and hampering conditions.

    Maybe Ferris Research can tell us?

    @4 - Okay, so that makes more sense. Ed's implication is that Microsoft is saying they'd like to make South Africa more like North Korea. Clearly a move in the wrong direction.

    I can assure Mr. Nyati that making South Africa a Notes-free country will prove... daunting. :-)

  1. 6  tonyo  | 8/13/2009 12:35:50 AM

    @5 sorry - I was referring to this { Link }

    :)

  1. 7  Dave Harris http://www.wavysworld.com | 8/13/2009 1:57:45 AM

    @2 "Hell, I'd like to make the US a Microsoft-free country."

    It just got a step closer ;o)

    { Link }

  1. 8  Darren http://www.dadams.co.uk | 8/13/2009 2:06:48 AM

    Liberation from Notes, but at the cost of becoming a slave to the Microsoft Enterprise Agreement and the Exchange roadmap. I'd give that a big 'no thanks' personally.

    Seriously, how arrogant are Microsoft, making the assumption that they will make life better for companies by removing Notes? What happened to listening to a customers business requirements?

  1. 9  Heinz Freiheit  | 8/13/2009 3:25:34 AM

    this slogan should be a hit in Germany

  1. 10  Ed Brill http://www.edbrill.com | 8/13/2009 6:40:18 AM

    @2/@4 - yes, thanks Antony, I apparently needed a few more words.

    @3/6 - is there now such a distinct lack of creativity in Redmond that you need to imitate competitor's campaigns, in addition to technology and products?

    @9 :-o

  1. 11  Philip Storry http://www.not-so-rapid.com | 8/13/2009 6:49:54 AM

    So, when they make the world free of Notes, what happens next?

    After all, when they got rid of Netscape they had no competition for IE, so they stopped development at the wonderfully perfect IE6.

    It was only when competition came back that they realised that the wonderfully perfect IE6 might, in some small way, be lacking, and resumed development.

    Actually, it just occurred to me - once IE6 had no competition, it became such a target for attacks that the Office team changed Outlook's HTML renderer to Word, didn't they?

    So not only was everyone's life improved by the stopping development at the perfectly wonderful IE6, but Microsoft also managed to force themselves to improve Outlook through their surplus of vision and dedication to software quality.

    Well, I'm convinced. Evidently as a convicted monopolist with such a proven history of serving their customer's needs, we can tell that they don't need competition as an incentive to improve.

    Let's just ditch the competition, and go all MS! What can possibly go wrong?

  1. 12  Kevin Mort http://www.theglobalmind.com | 8/13/2009 7:00:57 AM

    Ah yes, more spin to make it seem like they have a slew of features Lotus doesn't, aka Unified Communications in this case.

    So remove Notes/Domino and replace it with Exchange/Outlook and automagically you have unified communications, eh? LOL!

  1. 13  Nathan T. Freeman http://nathan.lotus911.com | 8/13/2009 8:03:51 AM

    Lotus Knows your conference schedule and cell phone number.

  1. 14  Reynoutvab  | 8/13/2009 8:12:05 AM

    As if IBM does not deliver Unified Communications.

    So that shows his knowledge of the Software market.

  1. 15  Mat Newman  | 8/13/2009 8:12:07 AM

    I like the tone of your retort Ed.

    It marks such a change from the defensive stance and withdrawal from market that characterised IBM's position on Notes (especially during the workplace era) until recently.

    It's great to see you (read IBM) stepping up to the plate, taking up the fight, implementing campaigns like LotusKnows and visibly taking off the gloves.

    There might be a few more voices taking up the "Notes free country" mantra - but that's only because WE all KNOW it takes more of them to administer, develop and manage using Redmond's tools, therefore there ARE more of them out there.

    I'm just as fired up about getting rid of the UNIFIED "Exchange/Sharepoint/SQL/IIS/LCS/PES/Windows/Active Directory/Outlook/Word/Excel/Powerpoint/Project/Messenger" bundle as they are about getting rid of us.

    The only UNIFIED thing about the above is that they all carry the same company brand.

    Were not just behind you mate, we're standing beside you, ready to take the 'tag' and step into the ring.

  1. 16  Irv Schor  | 8/13/2009 8:14:53 AM

    We completed a migration from Exchange/Outlook to Domino/Lotus Notes (yes, that's what I said "to Domino/Lotus Notes") for one of our shops over there a couple of years ago). The the server was setup 100% remotely, as well as the Domino upgrades from versions 7.x>8.x, and just last week to version 8.5.x (which, by the way, took all of less than 30 minutes to upgrade, including a restart). Not one nickel spent on travel or consulting, nor one hiccup. When will the folks who actually spend your company's money on IT budgets become truly accountable for their IT $pending and transient costs? In addition to permitting the subsidiary to perform their own local backups for country compliance, we have replicas back here for corporate compliance, and, if for any reason they did have a problem they can get still get to their mail via a browser against our systems. The general challenge of Internet connections alone to/from South Africa should make for interesting fodder for any large shops attempts to move from Notes to Exchange (...so if you are tempted by Mteto, you may wish to fully research before you try).

  1. 17  Colin Macdonald  | 8/13/2009 9:02:29 AM

    Africa is full of case studies where a people break free of their chains only to sink into a hell of dictatorship, oppression, civil war and/or genocide. All driven by the ego and lust for power of one man.

    One could call that THE African Meme.

    Nyati's type of rhetoric has unfortunately been doing the rounds for years in SA's politacal sphere, and has proved to be just as full of empty promises.

  1. 18  Marius Bock http://www.henriska.com/blog/ | 8/13/2009 1:44:55 PM

    And the biggest irony of this all is that Mteto Nyati worked for IBM SA until a couple of months ago before he became MD of Microsoft. He was GTS (Global Technology Services) Exec and in his 12 years at IBM he surely got to understand IBM Software business.

  1. 19  David Hablewitz  | 8/13/2009 2:16:10 PM

    When you're the best, everyone makes you their target.

  1. 20  Andy Mell  | 8/13/2009 3:32:32 PM

    Well, I'm just about to commence a Exchange to Notes 8.5 migration in Cape Town, so I think MS have their work cut out!

  1. 21  tonyo  | 8/13/2009 6:43:09 PM

    @11 - competition is good for business all around. also if memory serves, IBM has some history with monopolies and the DOJ as well. { Link }

  1. 22  John Smart http://www.greyduck.com | 8/13/2009 7:20:26 PM

    wow. "Attack their strenghts"

    Next up: Microsoft touts its commitment to backwards compatibility & how Excange allows for a mixed version environment.

  1. 23  Randall Shimizu  | 8/13/2009 10:47:54 PM

    I just wish IBM/Lotus would adopt a more assertive tone with MS...!

  1. 24  Ed Brill http://www.edbrill.com | 8/13/2009 11:00:41 PM

    @21 all you can say at this point is stuff that happened 30 years ago? How about answering which countries are "Notes free" on behalf of Kevin Turner? (BTW, I may have to retract my earlier statements on this subject).

  1. 25  tonyo  | 8/14/2009 12:53:15 AM

    @24 why is being "Notes free" any different than being "Microsoft free?"

    IBM says things Microsoft doesn't like. Microsoft says things that IBM doesn't like. Google is saying things neither company likes.

    and what part of competing for marketshare don't you understand? it's all about being provocative, making bold statements and then deliving a better product. The entire US sports industry is built on this.

    if the products or service suck, customers will chose another product because they can. That kind of competition forces all of us (Microsoft, IBM, Google, Oracle and now Cisco) to listen to our customers and deliver things people want or will want.

    Please do. It's good for the market.

  1. 26  Stuart McIntyre http://blog.collaborationmatters.com | 8/14/2009 4:44:37 AM

    @25 It's not the competition that we dislike, it's the damn lies, arrogance and offensive rhetoric that upsets.

    If you are putting forward either your own words or those of Mteto Nyati as simply "making bold statements" then it doesn't say much for Microsoft's corporate ethics.

  1. 27  Michael  | 8/14/2009 7:48:42 AM

    @24, I think that you are not just a little naive about MS business practice and history (well, not only MS, others too). MS certainly are NOT that naive to leave a multi billion USD business to simplistic "customers can/will choose what is best for themselves". Conversely, customer track record of what "is best" is far more political and phsycological.

    MdH

  1. 28  Philip Storry http://www.philipstorry.net | 8/14/2009 8:34:48 AM

    Perhaps I should clarify my earlier comment.

    tonyo: Yes, IBM were monopolists a long time ago, and they learnt their lesson. Since then they've often been thought of as unresponsive and rigid, and that's often because IBM doesn't want that kind of trouble again.

    Microsoft still have to prove that they've learnt their lesson.

    Competition is good, and there's a very reasonable case for saying that when Microsoft was not a benevolent monopolist once competition was removed. (Just as there was such a case with IBM 30 years ago.)

    So why, when a Microsoft representative states that they WANT TO BE A REGIONAL MONOPOLY, should we regard this is anything even remotely positive?

    My main point was that it's not actually the competitors who should find this disturbing.

    It's Microsoft's own customers.

    You later agreed that competition is good. So surely it's incredibly unwise for a convicted monopolist to declare an interest in creating a monopoly?

  1. 29  Djalma Britto  | 8/14/2009 10:03:23 AM

    And who told that being in MS hands is good hands ? If that happens probably prices will rise, innovation will slow down..

  1. 30  tonyo  | 8/14/2009 11:07:01 AM

    @28 He said "Notes free" not "Notes, oracle, Google, and Cisco" free :)

  1. 31  Michael de Haas  | 8/14/2009 1:55:35 PM

    Sorry Ed, that should be @25 tonyo. @28 Philip, I agree, the MS customers should be worried. If they are not concerned and voice disapproval for this brand of 'competitiveness', then I am certainly concerned for them.

    MdH

  1. 32  Martijn de Jong http://www.socialsoftwareblog.nl | 8/18/2009 5:10:15 AM

    Though Microsoft's statement is arrogant and above that totally unrealistic, it is true that Lotus Domino lost ground in SA in the past years. It's to read comments of some wins in SA, but I think that many financial companies (like Sanlam) moved away from Notes. Financial companies used to be the stronghold of Lotus Domino because of its better security over Exchange and I think that reason still stands firm. Maybe time for IBM to put some more focus on that again?